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🗓 Last Time

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🎙 Interview

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📇 Biography

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📜 Transcript

Roxie Key: [00:00:00] I just wanted to try and drop straight into the action, and that was part of the feedback that I had from my agent in the editorial process, was let’s just cut a bit of this and just get straight to it.

But you obviously wanted to still build up a little bit of the character and the setting as well. There is a balance, but it can be quite hard to get quite right, so hopefully I’ve done it.

David Gwyn: So how should you start your novel? Should you have a prologue? Should you jump right into the action? Should you spend time with the characters or the setting? Today’s guest is going to help talk us through how and why she started her novel the way she did. And I have to tell you, it might be her debut, but she knocked this opening out of the park.

I can’t wait to talk about it. I’m David Gwyn, an agented writer navigating the world of traditional publishing. During this first season of the Thriller 101 podcast, we’re going to focus on building the skills necessary to write the kinds of thrillers that you want that land you an agent and readers.

During the season, I’m talking to agents and authors and other industry professionals about the best way to write a novel. If you want the expert secrets, this is where you’re [00:01:00] going to find them.

Last week on the podcast, we talked to Daniel Hurst about how he comes up with the compelling hooks for his novels that make readers excited about reading his books.

Daniel Hurst: Obviously there’s going to be many kind of hard times where you’re going to, be tired from your day job.

There might be some rejection. You might worry, is this going to work? I certainly had plenty of years when I thought, am I wasting, you know, all my nights here? You know, staying up till midnight writing. But I think it’s find what works for you

David Gwyn: Click the link in the description if you want to check out that episode. Today I’m talking to Roxie Key about how she developed the opening of her novel in a way that made it so compelling for readers.

Roxie lives in Northampton, UK with her wife and daughter, currently working as a creative copywriter for a global brand. She has a degree in creative writing and an unhealthy obsession with crime thrillers. Her debut thriller, The Deadly Spark, is a dark, compelling crime novel about the fallout after a deadly house fire, and it is out right now.

Let’s get straight into the interview.

Roxie, thanks so much for being here on Thriller 101. We’re really excited to have [00:02:00] you.

Roxie Key: for having me.

Yeah,

David Gwyn: The Deadly Spark, will be out by the time people hear this, so how do you feel now and how do you think you’ll feel on the day of it getting released?

Roxie Key: I feel like it’s not real. Yeah, it’s just because it’s something I’ve been wanting to do, like, my entire life. So it is very strange to think it’s actually happening I don’t know how I feel . I think It’ll be when I first see it in a shop for the first time. I think that will probably be the moment where I’m like, Oh, wow, it’s happening.

Yeah, it’ll start

David Gwyn: to feel real. I imagine when it’s when it’s out there and you get to see it. That’s really cool. Do you have any plans for the day of the release? Are you going to do anything special?

Roxie Key: Well, so the day before I’m doing an event in Manchester so me and my wife staying overnight, so we’re going to be driving back on the day.

So I’ll probably be in the car like reading all the messages and things from people on Twitter and stuff. But yeah, I don’t think I’ve got anything big planned, just gonna put the day off work.

David Gwyn: Oh, that’s good. At least you don’t have to go to work. Very cool. So [00:03:00] yeah, can you tell us a little bit about the Deadly Spark, about what it’s about?

Roxie Key: Yeah, so it’s like a mix of psychological suspense and police procedural. Basically I really love various genres and I just wanted to merge the two. Set in Brighton, that’s my favourite place in the UK. And also a little bit in the Scottish Highlands as well. And it follows the story of Eve Starling and she’s investigating a fatal arson attack.

Meanwhile another character is being killed. The story is unfolding alongside Eve’s story. Anya Fernsday, who is the girlfriend of the woman who died in the arson attack, who threw herself off the cliffs at Seaford Head that same night. And it’s Eve’s job to find out whether that was grief or guilt.

David Gwyn: So, how did you come up with the idea for this story? Where did it come from?

Roxie Key: So, I, I’ve been trying to write a book for most of my adult life and most of them tend to not sizzle out at about 7, 000 words so this one I guess I was thinking about what’s something that’s terrifying [00:04:00] for me and one of my biggest phobias is fire which came from when I was a child.

I think I was about four at primary school and we were shown a video. How quickly a house can go up in place and I was dragged out the room screaming. And ever since then I’ve just been like, have this awful phobia of fire. And so I thought, you know, I write about my worst fear, my house going up in flame.

I said, I can give it a really, like, real sense of terror but the actual plot itself, I, it’s hard to say because I actually came up with the, one of the plot twists, I can’t say that here. I think the plot twist kind of worked back from that as well.

David Gwyn: Yeah. That’s so interesting. I, I love that idea of taking something that you’re afraid of in real life and like fictionalizing it.

Because I imagine. You know, for a lot of people, you know, we write, we write thrillers. We’re trying to unsettle people in some way. And so using something like that from your real life is really interesting. Do you, do you feel like having written about it, are you more or less afraid or the [00:05:00] same as you were before?

Roxie Key: Probably the same. I’ve learned quite a bit about the about how fires work and my father in law is actually an ex firefighter. So he was able to fact check as well, which is great. But I also learned quite a lot from him and talk about different ideas of how the fire could be started or how it could spread.

And I think it just made, gave me more fear and there’s more ways fire can That’s

David Gwyn: So so yeah, how much can you tell us about what you’re working on now? Are you working on a second book or what are you doing?

Roxie Key: Yes, I’ve had a lot of people who have read the book early who really want to see a sequel.

So, I’ve been working on that for a while. It’s not it’s not been bought by a publisher just yet but I am hopeful. Yes, I’m working on a sequel with the same detective, Eve Starling. Still set in Brighton but this time it’s about a drowning, so the [00:06:00] opposite.

David Gwyn: Yeah, right, exactly. And did that grow out of a phobia too, or where’s that one from?

No, I think I

Roxie Key: just, I came up with it, so all that, that worked quite nicely. Imagine the covers next to each other. And then I’m, I’ve got an idea bubbling away for the third as well, which I’ve sort of got to a synopsis stage with now. Yeah, trying to get ahead. I’ve finally had time to work on it lately with all the all the promo for The Deadly Spark.

David Gwyn: I’m sure. Yeah, you’re probably looking forward to like probably like two ish weeks from now as it starts to slow down and die down. You’re like, okay, you can get back to work, right?

Roxie Key: Yeah, crack on on the second one.

David Gwyn: Yeah, that’s cool. So I’d love for you to talk a little bit about your, your agent, just tell us who you’re repped by and, and what you love about working with her.

Roxie Key: Oh yeah, she’s great. So my agent is Madalena Cavatritti, who is with David Hyam Associates in London. She’s amazing. She’s fantastic. She is so good at giving me editorial feedback as well and bouncing ideas. [00:07:00] So she’s not just an agent who will just take my manuscript and send it off. Like, we worked for a long time together on this book, actually getting it to a really great place.

She just comes up with such good ideas she’s just so great. I’m, I’m so, so pleased that she’s my agent.

David Gwyn: And like a lot of people who are listening, you know, want to be in the position that you’re in, having a, having a novel coming out. I think when, whenever I talk to authors and they talk about their agents, I feel like that’s such an important part of, especially an author earlier in their career, like having that person who you can bounce ideas off of, who will give you feedback is, is really, really valuable.

So that’s awesome. That’s great that you found that, that relationship. That’s really cool.

Roxie Key: Yeah. And also just having someone so I can say, I don’t know if this is a stupid question, but and she can just go off and find answers for me or I’ll have to write people the right things or answer those questions so stupid in front of an editor.

And so yeah, that’s also quite helpful

David Gwyn: Okay, so let’s pause there for a second. for her novel. I found it really interesting that she used [00:08:00] an experience she’s personally afraid of to draw inspiration. Might be something worth exploring in our own writing.

Also, we’ve published another author contributor to thriller101. com. I’m excited to share Eloise Corvo’s article where she shares the four steps she took to turn her standalone novel into a series. Here’s the first piece of advice she shares.

Answer the big question. Plot wise, am I more Only Murders in the Building or Scooby Doo? Do I want major arcs over the course of more than one book, or keep each book distinct stories? Only Murders in the Building has one major mystery that takes place over the course of many episodes, where Scooby Doo, or Murder, She Wrote, Law Order, etc.,

are self contained stories within the same setting. Both are totally valid, but it’s important to figure that out early on. You’ll have to read the article for the rest of Eloise’s advice, and you’ll hear the story of how she had to kind of come up with a process on the fly of how to turn her standalone into [00:09:00] a series, Which I found really interesting.

That link is in the description. You’ll be able to check that out there. And if you’re a writer on any part of your writing journey and want to share what insights and experiences you’ve had along the way, Thriller 101 is accepting pitches for articles. You can pitch your article to the link in the description. And the next part of the interview, we’re going to talk about why Roxie started her story with a prologue, how she thinks about the opening chapter of her novels and so much more. Let’s get back into it.

Yeah, like I mentioned, a lot of my audience is, is made up of writers and I thought the opening scenes, the kind of prologue in chapter one, early, really chapter one were set up so well in your novel. And so I’d love to talk a little bit about that https: otter.

ai It’s funny, I feel like people are either very pro or very against prologue, and I’m pro prologue, obviously, like if it does, if it serves a function, which I think that this did, and so I’m curious about the prologue that you wrote, like, was that something that was always there? Is that something that was [00:10:00] added?

And what do you feel like it does for you? To benefit the story as a whole.

Roxie Key: Yeah, I’m quite a fan of the prologue. I, I like the prologue. I like to have a little glimpse of what’s going to happen. And then I often, when I get to that point in the book, I will then go back to the prologue and read it again.

And sometimes it’s slightly different. And yeah, I like it because in this, in this story, it’s Just sort of tucks you straight into the action at the beginning, gives you a bit of mystery, and then the reader will hopefully spend a little bit of time trying to work out the link between what was she doing on the cliffs at the beginning and what that got to do with this fire.

Yeah, I did, I’ve always had a prologue, although the original, very, very early manuscript, it was a completely different prologue yeah, it actually started in, with the actual fire. But it all changed around in the end. And I think it’s a lot stronger. But yeah, big fan of prologue. If they have a purpose, [00:11:00] like you say.

David Gwyn: And I feel like too with, with thrillers, because often with a thriller, and this is not necessarily true of your book, but I think like generally speaking, like sometimes it takes a little while to get into the The speed and the action and the tension and all that. And so I think a prologue, what it does is like you said, like sets up that like vibe, the tone of what the book’s going to be in a way that the opening chapters sometimes don’t in thrillers.

I think that’s, that’s a really interesting thing to think about.

Roxie Key: Yeah. And I think because mine’s a mix of the two genres, like I said earlier. Chapter 1 is very obviously a police procedure, so I quite liked that it opened with a bit more of a mystery, kind of, a bit of suspense before we got into who’s the detective and this is the case.

You know, a lot of books start that same way.

David Gwyn: And can you talk a little bit more about that? So you have this kind of blend between, like you said, psychological thriller and a police procedural. Was it just that [00:12:00] you had these two ideas and you’re like, I’ll just smash them together and see what happens?

Like, how did that come about?

Roxie Key: Yeah, I think what I was reading at the time, actually saying kind of stuff I’m reading now I’m reading a crime police procedural series by Jane Casey. That I absolutely love, and I was also spending a lot of time reading psychological thrillers, and I was like, I want to write that, I want to write that, and I can’t make up my mind, and I kept writing bits of one style and then the other, and then I just thought, I feel like I can probably make this work with multiple timelines and multiple perspectives, which is a nightmare to plan, but Really, really good when it all comes together.

David Gwyn: I feel like now, and I could be wrong, it just, it seems like a trend to me where people are, are taking two genres. They’re taking like thriller and something else, like thriller more general. Like I’ve seen a lot of like thriller and romance and like thriller and speculative.

And you’re like, this is, it’s, it’s a cool time to be writing the genre. I think because of, of the work that people like you are doing where You’re saying like, okay, there’s this thing and there’s this thing. Well, what if they’re together? What if, what if [00:13:00] they’re, they’re happening at the same time? And I think that’s a really great way to think about writing something that’s really unique.

Like, like what you did here.

Roxie Key: Yeah, I think because there’s a lot of market is really saturated and there’s just so much out there. So I think if you can take something and put a spin on it, it’s going to help you stand out.

David Gwyn: Yeah, it’s very cool. So now I wanna talk about the beginning of chapter one here.

So you’ve got your prologue, we talked a little bit about that. Now we got chapter one and, and I mean you really quickly and efficiently drop us into the action of this story. I mean, we’re with within the end of chapter one, or at that before the break of chapter one, I should say. There you’re like page and a half in, and there’s this like, major moment, right?

Where there’s like a lot of tension. What was the process like for, for working through that chapter that. Even just beginning of chapter one, like, was that something that you had to work on a lot? Was that always kind of there? You’re like, this is definitely where my, I want my inciting incident to be.

Like how, how did that work out?

Roxie Key: So I’m trying to think back to the first, first draft and I think I made the [00:14:00] classic mistake of too much detail up front originally. I just wanted to try and drop straight into the action, and that was part of the feedback that I had from my agent in the editorial process, was let’s just cut a bit of this and just get straight to it.

But you obviously wanted to still build up a little bit of the character and the setting as well. There is a balance, but it can be quite hard to get quite right, so hopefully I’ve done it.

David Gwyn: Yeah, no, I think you did. I think I think people who are listening, if you want to see how well this was done, I’d definitely pick up on this book, The Deadly Spark, because it, it was like so well done, where I got enough of character, there was movement, I mean she had like just kind of finished a workout or a run, so like you’re getting movement, you’re getting character, and then you’re getting Like the set, the setup of the main issue of the story.

And so I think it was just so well done in this like really tightly condensed area. And so I think that’s really, really interesting. We have a pitch contest as part of Thriller 101. And so I read a lot of submissions of people who are querying and want to, you know, I see this a lot in those opening couple of [00:15:00] paragraphs where it’s like, you’re telling us too much.

You got to get into whatever it is. And I think this was so well done. So I definitely check that out if you’re listening. Roxie, this was a lot of fun. I have, I have one more question for you, which is just where can people find you? Where can people look you up?

Roxie Key: So in the US it will be available.

Actually it’ll be available by the time this goes live,. On e book and audio for now and then I believe in September it will be coming out in paperback. My website’s Roxiekey. com. Nice and simple. That’s Roxie with an I E, not a Y. And there’s all the information about my current book, a little bit about me, a blog with my latest news and events links to podcasts and things like that, and any articles that I’ve written. So yeah, it’d be great to get in touch.

I’ve started up a newsletter as well, so you can sign up there.

David Gwyn: Nice. And so if you’re listening and you want quick access to Roxie, I will make sure that I. Put all those links in the description. So head down, check that stuff out. And, and Roxie, this was so much fun. Thanks so much for taking the time to chat.

Roxie Key: You’re welcome. Thank you so much for having me. It’s great.

David Gwyn: Okay, so that’s [00:16:00] it. Hopefully you got a better sense of how Roxie organizes the opening of her novels and why she likes prologues when they’re done right, of course.

Remember to pitch your article in the description if you’re interested, and check out Eloise’s article so you have a better sense of how you might turn your standalone novel into something with series potential. Next time on the podcast, I’ll be talking to Alex Kenna, author of What Meets the Eye, about how to balance conflict in your character’s personal life and professional life.

This is so important for authors in our genre. You’re not going to want to miss it. Make sure you subscribe if you haven’t already, and I’ll see you next week.