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🗓 Last Time

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🎙 Interview

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📇 Biography

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📜 Transcript

Michelle Glogovac: [00:00:00] all of these ways are going to bring you. visibility, your author brand, it’s going to sell books, it’s going to help you when you’re doing that proposal of where have you been, oh I was featured on all of these podcasts and I can also go back and ask to be on again because now I have a book coming out and it’s part of my marketing plan.

David Gwyn: Okay, so you listen to podcasts. I mean, obviously you’re listening to this right now, but have you ever thought about being a guest on a podcast or just being interviewed in general? It’s never too early to build your platform and to start thinking about the all important author interviews you’ll ultimately have to go through.

In today’s episode, my guest is going to talk about why you should want to be on a podcast as a writer and author and how to pull it off. So whether you’re planning on being on podcasts this year or just some point in the future, you’re going to love this episode today. I’m David Gwyn, an agented writer navigating the world of traditional publishing during this first season of the Thriller 101 podcast, we’re going to focus on building the skills [00:01:00] necessary To write the kinds of thrillers that land you, an agent, and readers, I’m talking to agents and authors and other industry professionals about the best way to write a novel.

If you want the expert secrets, this is where you’re going to find them. Last week on the podcast, I talked to literary agent Carey Blankenship Kramer.

Carey Blankenship-Kramer: I love when an opening page can make me forget I’m an agent, and just become a reader in that moment.

You’re right, I don’t have a checklist at all of what I’m looking for. I think as long as you don’t keep yanking me out of the story , like, let me just be there with you in the moment but you wouldn’t really notice it until you pull yourself out and look at it in a more analytical way.

David Gwyn: That episode is linked in the description.

If you want the chance to land a full request from one of the Thriller 101 guest agents, then submit your pitch and first 500 words to the link in the description. Today’s guest is something a little bit different than my normal interviews, but I had the chance to talk to Michelle and I couldn’t be more excited to bring this interview to you. Today’s guest [00:02:00] is Michelle Glogovac. She is the podcast matchmaker and award winning publicist, host of the My Simplified Life podcast and author of How to Get on Podcasts. Michelle is working with clients who make an impact by defining their stories and matching them with the perfect podcasts. She’s helped entrepreneurs, authors, nonprofits, and advocates hone their storytelling abilities.

Grow their businesses and elevate themselves as thought leaders on over 1000 podcasts. Michelle is a sought after speaker in this niche and has presented to thousands of publicists and groups on how to not only perfectly pitch a podcast, but to create marketing content from every interview.

She has coached 14,000 authors through the process of creating and launching a podcast book tour. I don’t want to waste any more time. Let’s get into this interview.

Michelle, thanks so much for being here. I’m so excited to chat with you.

Michelle Glogovac: Thank you. I’m so excited to be here.

David Gwyn: Before we get started and we, we have a lot to talk about but before we do, can you just tell people a little bit about yourself?

Michelle Glogovac: Yes. I am Michelle Glogovac. I am the [00:03:00] podcast matchmaker, the host of the My Simplified Life podcast, author of How to Get on Podcasts. And I’m the owner of the MLG Collective, a podcast PR agency. I’m a wife, a mom of two, a step mom of two, a firm mom, and I have my BA and my master’s in law. Obviously, took a very big detour from law and also had an 18 year corporate career in it.

Corporate Aviation where I sold jet fuel to Corporate Flight Departments. So you’re quite

David Gwyn: the, quite the slacker. Really got to get on something.

Michelle Glogovac: Well,

David Gwyn: I do want to talk about it. I’m holding it up so that, so that I know people can’t see it, but I do, I do have my copy. And I’m, I’m so excited. I, I like just kind of dug into it.

But I should have just

Michelle Glogovac: screenshotted that. That, that needs to go on social media.

David Gwyn: I will. We’ll do that at the end, because I think that is a great idea. So yeah, can you, can you tell us a little bit about this book How to Get on Podcasts? It’s, it’s out, it came out in January can you tell us a little bit about what it’s about?

Michelle Glogovac: It is [00:04:00] literally everything you need to know to get on podcasts, but it is not a boring business book, not a, just a how to, there’s a lot of fun. I like to say it’s fun because I think I’m kind of funny sometimes.

And I got to read the book back. So there are some really fun parts, but it really, How’s you dive into what are your unique speaking topics and each topic is broken down into a friend type of category so you can relate, you know, is it your business journey that you’re talking about? Is it your personal journey?

What is your knowledge? And it breaks down all of those different categories for you to create speaking topics. Take those to create a branded media kit. And then it shows you how to not only research podcasts, but what best practices should go into your pitch, how you need to be personal in them.

There’s no copy and paste. And then once you get that, yes, how do you show up as a guest that people want to have on the show? How do you thank your host? Do you just throw it up in your Instagram stories for 24 hours? No, we call that [00:05:00] lazy. And so it also dives into how do you repurpose all of these interviews into greater marketing content that really allows you to show up for 30 minutes and then have a month’s worth of content from those 30 minutes.

Well, gaining visibility and then the entire experience is compared to a dinner party where the podcast host is your dinner party host, and you have just been invited into their home, which is their show, and it just kind of simplifies it so that you can really just be a good genuine person who’s engaging and has a conversation just as you would at a dinner party.

David Gwyn: Yeah, I think that’s so, and for people who are listening, you’re probably thinking this book is like a textbook, because there’s so much valuable information, but it really, it really is very, like, not that, which I think in a good way, like, I think people sometimes think, like, oh man, I gotta read this textbook on this and textbook on that, and like, as writers, as authors, like, You’ve got a lot going on, you know, you’re writing your next book, you’re living a life, you probably have a job, like, [00:06:00] and so to take this on is really, is really important and for people to definitely check out this book I’m sure you know, you probably, you know better than I do, Once the book kind of starts coming out and you’ve got like, you’ve got a lot going on and you want to brush up on this early.

So definitely pick up a copy if, if you’re planning on, you know, launching a book at some point, this is an absolute must. And I will tell you, because I, I just started this process. I talked to a friend of mine who has a, had a book coming out. And she was like, how do I pitch? How would I pitch a podcast like yours?

And I was like, I went back in my head and like, thought about all the terrible pitches.

Michelle Glogovac: I was

David Gwyn: like, Oh, yeah, no, I could absolutely just give you a few pointers. But I’m absolutely gonna recommend this podcast. book to her because I think it’s even more helpful. It’s, it’s super cool. So tell us a little bit more about this, this podcast, like a dinner party.

I love this analogy. I’ve never heard it before and it, it does feel like that. So can you talk a little bit more about that?

Michelle Glogovac: I love dinner parties. I, I talk about my happy [00:07:00] hour crew in the book because we literally have, there’s four couples where we get together almost every single month and we rotate who’s hosting and we call it happy hour and yet it’s always dinner like there’s no just drinks involved there’s a full meal and everything and so as I have been doing this for over five years now I thought you know this is really just like a dinner party because your host is a host that you’re getting that invitation and there’s so many similarities between a podcast And a dinner party.

And in the book we say, I say, you know, it could be a dinner party. It could be a backyard barbecue. It could be a Netflix and chill. Although I just found out Netflix and chill is a little different. The

David Gwyn: chill part might not be what you mean it to be.

Michelle Glogovac: Literally found this out as I was recording the audiobook and the engineer’s like, can we pause for a second?

So we get all the way to the printing part and nobody else recognized that it’s a different meaning. So the book could take on a whole new life of itself. But you know, it doesn’t [00:08:00] matter what type of gathering you’re going to, you know, you show up with a gift. What is that gift? Did you bring flowers?

Did you bring a bottle of wine? Did you bring a six pack of beer? Whatever it is, you’re showing up with something and you’re doing the same thing with a podcast. You will show up with a freebie or something to give a checklist or your first chapter, you know, a sneak peek or book club questions. You can show up with a gift.

Right away. You’re going to engage with the host and have a conversation. You wouldn’t be on your phone in someone’s home Typing away and just, you know, ignoring them just like you shouldn’t be, you know, sitting on your email I’ve had interviews where I had the video off and I could hear someone typing.

And I’m like, no, just, just be present for the 30 minutes to an hour. And, you know, then engage in conversation that it’s really that simple. Give of yourself, you know, ask questions, answer questions that are asked of you. And then as you leave and you’re going to thank your host, you know, the next day, whether that’s a text message or, [00:09:00] you know, back in my day, we’d handwrite thank you notes.

But you should be doing that by repurposing your interview and sharing it with your audience and tagging the host. And that’s the nicest way that you can thank a podcast host is by sharing the interview. And yet it doesn’t happen nearly as often as it should. And I think we forget how many ways that we can take an interview.

break it into pieces so you can pull, I say, pull a transcript and then identify quotes that you have made that you can turn into graphics for social media. And especially as authors, you don’t, who likes to create content? Like that’s not even an author thing. That’s an everybody thing. And you’re constantly showing up.

Well, now you have your own quotes that are valuable that you can put into gorgeous graphics that are in Canva. There’s actually templates in the book for you to use. You just brand them to your own colors. And now you have. social media content. You can create a blog post out of what, you know, where were you [00:10:00] featured and what was said.

Take the, I explain how to take the player so you can embed the code into your website so they don’t even have to leave your website and the download still goes to the host. So it’s more win win for everybody, but it’s simple and it can be done. And once you have a process in place where you know that if this interview has gone live, I’m going to do all of these things.

Check, check, check. That’s also in the Trello board. There’s a template in the book. I’ve done it all for you. So you really just need to show up and, and, you know, get it done. But all of these ways are going to bring you. visibility, your author brand, it’s going to sell books, it’s going to help you when you’re doing that proposal of where have you been, oh I was featured on all of these podcasts and I can also go back and ask to be on again because now I have a book coming out and it’s part of my marketing plan.

So there’s so many benefits to it on top of it’s a great networking and relationship builder. You know, now that we’re connected, now we can reach out to each other, whether it’s On [00:11:00] guests or, you know, anything else on writing a ton of things. So it just, it can build into so much more if you just put the work.

into it and a little bit of effort besides just showing up.

David Gwyn: Yeah, like so much to unpack I think it’s absolutely true that, you know, a lot of podcast hosts don’t make money doing this.

So they don’t make much. And so they’re doing Yeah. And so they’re doing it. for a purpose. Like I, I love to like, you know, share with writers about the things that I’m going through as they’re going through it. And like, you know, we, as, as podcast hosts, like we want to share that stuff. And as somebody who just comes on the show and like has that kind of professionalism where they’re like, Hey, I understand what you’re trying to do.

Here’s the message. Here’s like, here’s the talking points. Like I’m going to share it. Like you said, it’s a win win. Like I’m happy that you’re sharing it because it gets my podcast out there. And you’re happy because it gets your voice out there. I think it’s so valuable. So so valuable.

I do have one question, which I’m really curious about, which is, [00:12:00] and maybe it’s obvious, but why a book? Why write a book to talk about podcasts? Is that something you always had in mind? Like, you obviously are an absolute pro at this. You have all this information in your head. Why share it in a book?

Michelle Glogovac: I’ve always wanted to write a book.

I’m a big reader and I know some, a lot of people can say that, you know, I’m an avid reader. Yeah, I had all the Babysitter Club books, you know, in fourth grade. My daughter’s now reading them. I love books. And to me, I also always feel like, I interview a lot of authors too. of their, in my eyes, they’re like celebrities.

I have now autographed books on my bookshelf. They are my most prized possession because it feels amazing to get that. And so I’m doing that for my kids too. Anytime an author comes to school, I’m like, yes, I will buy the autographed book. And so I feel like there’s also that celebrity aspect, but we never know.

who the author is when we see him on the street. I, this, two weeks ago I was in New York and this woman’s in the lobby and we’re chit chatting [00:13:00] and she’s like, oh, do you have a book? You know, cause it was an author event. I’m like, yeah it just came out yesterday and she’s like, oh, mine came out two weeks ago.

And she said her name and I was like, why do I know the name? I know the name. I had downloaded her book the night before on my computer. And, yeah, so when I walked away and then I Googled, I’m like, oh man, that’s her! So, I turned around and I told her, you know, I have your book actually. I know who you are.

But so I always wanted to, I wanted that experience to have my name on a book, to write a book. And I interviewed a book coach on my show. And I said that I would like to write a book someday. And she goes on what? And I’m like, I don’t know. What do you write your first book on? Like where do I don’t even know where to begin.

And she goes, well, your first book should be on what you know and what you’re known for. And that to me was like the no brainer. I’m like, okay, then I can write on podcasts and how to do it. And right away I wrote the outline for all of the chapters. That was, that was easy. I knew everything I wanted to include.

I hired a book coach for three months to do the proposal and I wrote the first two [00:14:00] chapters and then I landed an agent and while she was landing a publisher, I wrote the rest of the book in a year and finished it off. But, you know, a big part of why I wanted to write a book was because I feel like our industry doesn’t have standards.

It is the wild, wild West and it’s, it’s a blessing and a curse. Yes. Everyone can have a podcast. Everyone can be a guest. That’s a blessing, but everybody should know. You know, what, what are the standards? Can you just copy and paste a pitch? No, you shouldn’t. But somehow people think that’s acceptable because nobody’s saying, This is how it should be done, and this is the standard that we’re going to accept as podcasters.

So that, that’s been a big part of why I also wanted the book to be out there to say this is going to be the standard for podcasting. If you want to be a guest, then you need to follow these rules. That it’s not going to be an Instagram story for 24 hours, and that’s acceptable. It’s not acceptable.

So that was a big part of, you know, it’s in [00:15:00] paper. So read it and, and follow it, make that your Bible for, you know, becoming a podcast guest.

David Gwyn: Okay, let’s pause there for a second. Michelle shared how to think about podcasts in like a theoretical sense. Like I mentioned, when we were chatting, I love the dinner host analogy, and I think it works perfectly for this in the next part of the interview. Michelle is going to talk about how to develop your unique story.

This is so well said by her and is so important. Whether you’re planning on being on podcasts or not, knowing how to tell your unique story is an insanely valuable and underrated part of just being an author. I write a weekly newsletter through Thriller 101 with exclusive information, advice, and updates you can only get in the newsletter. I talk about goal setting, systems, productivity, and I share the best resources and advice for thriller writers from all around the internet.

If you want to level up your writing skills, be sure to subscribe. There’s a link in the description where you can do that., let’s get back to the interview. Authors, I think, are coming around on the [00:16:00] idea of podcasts I think they like it because, you know, writers, generally speaking, are not go out and hang out with people type of people. Right, right. So, they’re like, wait, I can sit in my house and talk to somebody who likes books and, like, this can be a thing.

So I think that’s a really great message for people. I’m curious, you know, you talk about in this book and in some of the other stuff that you do about like, Cultivating a story, or your story, your unique story as a, as a podcast guest. I think a lot of authors go into podcasts just hoping not to mess up, and like, they go in, they end up telling like, really generic vanilla stories, and it really is hard to pull out something that makes this, this interview different than another one.

So can you talk a little bit about why it’s so important to, Find your story before you go on a podcast and and how that works as like a podcast. Guess why it’s so valuable

Michelle Glogovac: You have to start before you even pitch before but forget the even guessing part before you pitch Think about what is your story and I even say in the book, you know You can talk to a friend talk to your partner [00:17:00] talk to somebody you can write it down You don’t have to write it all down, but start thinking about it.

And the more you think about it, you know That’s when the ideas in the shower will come up and oh, yeah, there was this time You And a problem for each and every one of us is we get stuck into our own heads of well, who’s going to be interested in this? And, you know, is it really that unique? And yes, the story is unique.

It’s always going to be unique because you are the only person who has gone through whatever it is that you’ve gone through, you’re doing whatever it is you’re doing, and you’re doing it your way. So even though you and I could have grown up in the same house per se, we’ve got different experiences and we’re coming at it with a different angle.

So that’s why it’s so important to not think that, you know, your story is not important, whatever it is. And that’s why I go into, you have different types of stories. That’s where the topics come in. You have a business story. If you’ve launched a business, What did that look like? You know, my story is that I went from the corporate world to, I launched my business with two [00:18:00] kids at home and, you know, we didn’t have a nanny or anything like that.

So that’s a part of my story. Then I’ve got my career story. How did I get into corporate aviation? for 18 years and stay there and then make this pivot into podcasting. And so that’s another story. You know, what was my actual personal story like of growing up and, and really diving into that because it is unique to me and, you know, my story is different than my brother’s story and we have different memories.

So these are all different stories that you can tell. And as you tell someone else, you’re going to realize which parts really resonate to you. And that’s why I think it’s important to talk to someone else and share your story. When I have clients and I onboard them, that’s what they have to do. They have to tell me their story and I’ll stop them and go, Oh, that right there.

that you need to talk about. Make sure you write it on a post it, because nobody’s going to see the post it that’s on your monitor when you’re doing a podcast. Write it to trigger that memory of, [00:19:00] oh, I need to make sure I mention this one point, because it’s what’s going to resonate with people. And people simply love that.

I love hearing the stories of other people. We just do. It’s human nature. Like, I’m an eavesdropper. I love to hear what’s going on at the table next to me if I can. And to just listen and pick up on that and, you know, to hear how did you overcome whatever it was you overcame? How did you write your book?

I love hearing what the writing rituals are of an author because none of them are the same. I went into this thinking, oh, everybody sits down and, you know, they, they write and these are their hours that they write. And it’s so not true. Nobody has the same ritual. No, not two people are lighting a candle, you know, or listening to music and some are in the garden and some are, you know, I’m in the basement of my home.

And even the way they craft the story is completely different because I thought if I want to write a novel, I’m like, ah, I can’t write a novel like fiction. Hmm. I don’t know. I’m good with a nonfiction. Here are the facts. Here’s how it is. [00:20:00] And so I’ve asked authors, how do you come up with your stories and, you know, are your characters like outlined and this, that?

There’s no rhyme or reason to it. There absolutely isn’t. And so to share those types of stories are fascinating because it also means that we’re not alone and whatever we’re doing as listeners is okay and we’re doing the right thing. So it’s, it’s a big comfort thing that, you know, it’s the intimacy between you and I are having this conversation and later people are going to eavesdrop in on this and they’re going to get to hear what we have to say and hopefully nod their heads.

David Gwyn: Yeah, I feel like story is everything when it comes to this stuff. And I think people, because they’ve lived those experiences, they think that their life and their story and the things that they have to share are really mundane. But they’re not because, like you said, there’s somebody else’s experience.

And that is just so interesting to us as human beings. Listening to somebody else talk about experiences that they’ve had is just infinitely interesting. I mean, like, [00:21:00] We can’t be overstated. I think that’s such an important thing for people to hear, is like, You may be somebody who you’re like, Oh, I’ve had this job forever.

Like, nobody cares about that. Like, yes, people do. It seems normal to you. This is why we love

Michelle Glogovac: reality TV. This is why true crime is such a big hit in podcasts, because we want to hear really what’s going on in the lives of other people.

David Gwyn: Yeah, it’s so interesting. I feel like I could talk to you forever.

This is so, this is so valuable. And I’m sure people are listening, like, please, Talk to her forever. This is so valuable. But I want to ask you two more questions. One you know, my audience is made up of, of authors, of people who are writing books and, and will eventually use podcasts in one way or another.

Hope people who I hope will pick up this book. And like you said, you know, read it. Like I’m doing, annotate it, make notes, make it your own. Is there anything that you think, the kind of like last message to authors who are listening to this, who are like thinking about podcasts or interested, but they’re like, where do I go from here?

Michelle Glogovac: I would say two things. One, don’t pitch your book. Because we’re not [00:22:00] interviewing the book, we’re interviewing you, the author. So don’t make your pitch, and I get a lot of pitches from publishers where they’re like, This is the book that’s coming out. I’m like, that’s cool, but what’s the book gonna say to me?

Pitch yourself as the author. And don’t really narrow things down to only the book that you’re working on or the topics that are within the book. You can be as wide as you want to in your media kit. I had, there was somebody that asked in a Facebook group the other day of, I’m a comedian, but I have like this trauma experience and I’m doing, there was, it was all over the place.

And she goes, what do I do? And I responded and said, you put every single topic in your media kit. And when you pitch to the podcasts, Choose the one or two topics that fit that podcast. That way they have access to everything in your media kit, but they can also see that you weren’t like, here’s all the spaghetti and I just threw it on the wall and pick one because I don’t know what you’re talking about.

So you can narrow it down inside the pitch, but don’t feel like you have to narrow it [00:23:00] down in your media kit, in your topics, and make it about you, the person, because it’s your brand as the author that we want to grow visibility, and you don’t even have to go on a show to talk about your book at the end of every show.

Every single one, they will say, and where can people find you? It’s, it’s the last question in every single podcast interview. And that’s where you can go, Oh, well, I also have a book that just came out and it’s called this and you can buy it here. And you can also find me on my social media, all of those types of things.

So don’t think that it has to be just about your book. Let people fall in love with you. And then they will want to go find your book or your product, your service, whatever it is that you are selling.

David Gwyn: Yeah, so show us how it’s done, because that’s my next question for you, which is where can people find you?

Where can people look you up?

Michelle Glogovac: Well, thank you for asking.

David Gwyn: You didn’t see this coming at all, right? I had

Michelle Glogovac: no idea. It’s such a surprising question. You can find me at the MLG collective. com [00:24:00] or my personal website is michelleglogovac. com. My Simplified Life is everywhere you listen to podcasts. And How to Get on Podcast is sold everywhere you can find books.

I’m also on Instagram and threads and Facebook and all of the places as well.

David Gwyn: Great. So if you’re listening, I will link to some of that stuff. So you have quick access. If you’re listening, like, I hope you understand what just happened. So we just got an absolute masterclass in all things podcast guesting.

It was an absolute pleasure. I have like a page worth of notes over here, as if I would never hear this again. But as if

Michelle Glogovac: you don’t have the book in your hands. Yeah, yeah, I

David Gwyn: still have notes. I’ve got notes. So this was awesome. Michelle, thank you so much for taking the time to thank

Michelle Glogovac: you so much. I had so much fun.

David Gwyn: Okay, so that’s it. Like I said, knowing how to craft your unique story is a great way to handle interviews of all kinds. I hope you learned as much as I did from that conversation

Next week, I’ll be talking to Ellie Monago about her new novel, The Custody Battle. I’ll see you next [00:25:00] week.